Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

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Geomtje
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Geomtje » Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:09 pm

Thormgrim wrote:
Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:52 pm
Was likely to begin with, but the Adventurers Book and Lorebook I bought used on a Convention are outdated by my Core Rules pdf it seems.
The slipcase version has an Adventure's Book and a Loremaster's Book, whereas the revised version is one big book, which includes both books in one. So have a look at whichever one has more pages.
Last edited by Geomtje on Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Geomtje
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Geomtje » Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:11 pm

Also, the ISBN of the revised version is 978-0-85744-244-4, which you can find on the second page.
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Thormgrim » Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:32 pm

Yep that confirms it, the pdf is the revised one. Thanks =)

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Indur Dawndeath
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Indur Dawndeath » Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:22 pm

Thormgrim wrote:
Mon Jan 15, 2018 11:50 am
Thanks for all the feedback =)
I'll let incorporate that into my planning of the adventure =)

Another minor Question, for a Group of 4 , what would you recommend as an introductory Combat Encounter on their way to Esgaroth?
I thought of maybe 4-6 Wild Wolves depending which pregen Characters they choose.
Or should I go with a group of Hill-Men ?

Thanks again =)
Hi Thormgrim,
As introduction you could have the party meet a small group of Hillmen with some Savage hounds (Use Wild wolves stats if you do not have Ruins adventure)
Have the Hillmen be very hostile and set it up as an encounter with tolerance 1. First failed test results in combat. 3 successes avoids combat...
A little bit of both, and fun if you let the players know in advance.
2 Hillmen, 4 Hounds. Enough to make it a sigificant challenge for beginners


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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Earendil » Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:45 pm

Indur Dawndeath wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:22 pm
Have the Hillmen be very hostile and set it up as an encounter with tolerance 1. First failed test results in combat.
Not to nitpick, but that would actually be a tolerance of 0. An encounter ends/fails when the number of failures exceeds the tolerance, not when it equals it.

I'm not sure I'd go with two different types of adversary for your very first combat; something fairly straightforward like a band of orc soldiers (equal in number to the player heroes) or wild wolves (one more than the number of player heroes so they can use their Seize Victim ability effectively, or or two more if there's six + players) might be better. In the case of the latter there's the added advantage that you can call for a Lore roll to realise that they're afraid of fire.

On the other hand, using hostile Men does mean you can try to avoid combat, introducing the Encounter rules as well...
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Indur Dawndeath
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Indur Dawndeath » Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:38 pm

Earendil wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:45 pm
Indur Dawndeath wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:22 pm
Have the Hillmen be very hostile and set it up as an encounter with tolerance 1. First failed test results in combat.
Not to nitpick, but that would actually be a tolerance of 0. An encounter ends/fails when the number of failures exceeds the tolerance, not when it equals it.
Now that you did nitpick...
“The Loremaster determines the Tolerance rating. The Tolerance rating of an encounter sets how many rolls can be failed by the companions before an encounter is effectively over.”
So tolerance 1, is 1 failed test before the encounter is over. P 154 adventurers companion.
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Falenthal » Wed Jan 17, 2018 7:51 pm

Indur Dawndeath wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:38 pm
Earendil wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:45 pm
Indur Dawndeath wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:22 pm
Have the Hillmen be very hostile and set it up as an encounter with tolerance 1. First failed test results in combat.
Not to nitpick, but that would actually be a tolerance of 0. An encounter ends/fails when the number of failures exceeds the tolerance, not when it equals it.
Now that you did nitpick...
“The Loremaster determines the Tolerance rating. The Tolerance rating of an encounter sets how many rolls can be failed by the companions before an encounter is effectively over.”
So tolerance 1, is 1 failed test before the encounter is over. P 154 adventurers companion.
Again, another nitpicker... :lol:

Earendil is right: Tolerance 1 means "1 roll can be failed before ending the Encounter".
Tolerance 0 means "no more rolls can be failed". But that doesn't mean that succesful rolls don't count anymore. The moment one roll is failed while the Tolerance is 0, that failure is not "tolerated" anymore and the Encounter ends.

So, in an Encounter with Tolerance 1, the company can fail 1 roll and still be in the Encounter. It's the second one that makes it end.

Or, to be even more nitpicking, the Encounter doesn't necesarily end; it is just that the LM stops counting successes towards the final outcome.

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Indur Dawndeath
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Indur Dawndeath » Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:27 pm

Falenthal wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 7:51 pm
Again, another nitpicker... :lol
Ok, I accept your interpretation.
But from a mathematical view point, if you can fail 0 tests before the encounter is over, then it is over already.

It also seems logical that 1 is the minimum tolerance, which would give the players one try. 2 tests is not logical as the minimum. P 188 Core rules

“Running out of tolerance may signify different things: that the encounter is simply over”

I’m out of apples, when I have zero apples”...

Sorry to nitpick back at you guys :shock:
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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Falenthal » Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:23 pm

Indur Dawndeath wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:27 pm
Ok, I accept your interpretation.
But from a mathematical view point, if you can fail 0 tests before the encounter is over, then it is over already.
I get the confusion, and I can't say I'm 100% sure I'm right. I seem I recall an official confirmation in these forums, but I might also be wrong about it.

The way I think the rules work is not that "you can fail 0 tests before ending the encounter", it is "you can fail o tests more before ending the encounter". So, "you can't fail anymore", but it isn't over still.

But if it feels more natural to you to say "tolerance 1 means 1 failure allowed", I don't think the Encounter system will break. Precisely, we are all complaining that Encounters are too easy. And, as I said previously, I can't assure that your way of doing it isn't right.

...Sidenote: My experience says that James R Brown's houserule for Encounters make them much more interesting (viewtopic.php?f=56&t=4500&p=63304&hilit ... les#p63304)

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Re: Firsttime TOR Loremaster asking for Marsh Bell Oneshot Advice

Post by Stormcrow » Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:31 pm

I asked Francesco about this once. He confirmed that the correct interpretation is exceed, not equal. When your failures equal the Tolerance, you are still in the encounter.

Since an encounter has a minimum Tolerance of 1, every encounter can tolerate at least one failure.

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