Dwarven Rings

The place for discussion of Cubicle 7 and Sophisticated Games' "Adventures in Middle-earth" OGL setting.
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steerpike65
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Re: Dwarven Rings

Post by steerpike65 » Mon Sep 04, 2017 8:32 pm

Thanks for that information. Very much appreciate the lore.
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Otaku-sempai
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Re: Dwarven Rings

Post by Otaku-sempai » Mon Sep 04, 2017 8:55 pm

atgxtg wrote:
Mon Sep 04, 2017 7:53 pm
Gandalf might have been speaking literally when he said that rings were "consumed by dragons". Instead of being destroyed by dragon-fire the rings could have been swallowed along with thier wearers while fighting dragons.
Possibly, though the implication is that those four Rings are all presumed lost and have not turned up to the knowledge of the Wise. Of course if you are inclined to ignore the published canon then all bets are off!
If you are so inclined, you could "reintroduce" such a ring if/when the heroes slay a dragon and find the ring either in it's lair or it's stomach. Just lay in the back story of some great Dwarf lord who was swallowed whole by some Dragon and you're good to go.
Within the legendarium that might work best for a Fourth Age campaign. However, who is to say that such a Ring was not one of the three that Sauron was known to have recovered?
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

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Terisonen
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Re: Dwarven Rings

Post by Terisonen » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:21 pm

Otaku-sempai wrote:
Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:37 pm
tomcat wrote:
Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:05 pm
As for when the four were consumed, you'll have to turn to fan fiction on that (MERP books might have a history of the rings - probably in the Moria book).
We do know that four of the Seven were lost before the War of the Ring. The Seven and the Nine were likely distributed some time between SA 1600, when Sauron forged the One Ring, and 1693 when the War the Elves and Sauron began. We don't know how Gandalf came by his information about the Dwarf-rings; however, he tells Frodo in The Fellowship of the Ring, Chapter 2 "The Shadow of the Past" (bolded for emphasis):
'The Three, fairest of all, the Elf-lords hid from [Sauron], and his hand never touched them or sullied them. Seven the Dwarf-kings possessed, but three he has recovered, and the others the dragons have consumed. Nine he gave to Mortal Men, proud and great, and so ensnared them.'
One of the recovered Rings was possessed by Thráin, Thorin's father. The other two might have been with Dwarf-lords in the farthest East where they might have been untroubled by dragons.
I remember that the reason Sauron goes to war with Elves was for recovering the Seven and The Nine (in fact as much rings as possible, but the Three were already in safe part of Eregion). They were forged by Elves, with the hand of Sauron, but not by Sauron himself.
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Re: Dwarven Rings

Post by Otaku-sempai » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:34 am

Terisonen wrote:
Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:21 pm
I remember that the reason Sauron goes to war with Elves was for recovering the Seven and The Nine (in fact as much rings as possible, but the Three were already in safe part of Eregion). They were forged by Elves, with the hand of Sauron, but not by Sauron himself.
I am finding it difficult to locate a firm timeline of certain events, but looking back at Tolkien's essay on the Rings of Power, I can see where I went wrong. We do know that Celebrimbor was alleged to have given the First of the Seven Rings to Durin III himself before Eregion was overrun. The Nazgûl first appeared in their undead form around the year 2250 in the Second Age, so Sauron must have distributed the Rings well before then--during the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries of the Second Age?
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

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Robin Smallburrow
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Re: Dwarven Rings

Post by Robin Smallburrow » Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:12 am

The introductory adventure The Dragon's Ring (see link in my sig) deals with a Dwarven Ring that Smaug had taken, feel free to use!

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Terisonen
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Re: Dwarven Rings

Post by Terisonen » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:37 am

Otaku-sempai wrote:
Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:34 am
Terisonen wrote:
Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:21 pm
I remember that the reason Sauron goes to war with Elves was for recovering the Seven and The Nine (in fact as much rings as possible, but the Three were already in safe part of Eregion). They were forged by Elves, with the hand of Sauron, but not by Sauron himself.
I am finding it difficult to locate a firm timeline of certain events, but looking back at Tolkien's essay on the Rings of Power, I can see where I went wrong. We do know that Celebrimbor was alleged to have given the First of the Seven Rings to Durin III himself before Eregion was overrun. The Nazgûl first appeared in their undead form around the year 2250 in the Second Age, so Sauron must have distributed the Rings well before then--during the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries of the Second Age?
True, by II - 1697 war is mostly over in Eregion, and Sauron had recovered all the rings it coveted (save the Three and the one 'lesser' ring given to Durin). It sound reasonnable that by 1700 - 1800 Sauron has given nine rings to great men to create the Nazgul. It take century (from, say 1800 to 2200) to transform Men to Nazgûl.
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Re: Dwarven Rings

Post by Otaku-sempai » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:17 pm

Terisonen wrote:
Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:37 am
True, by II - 1697 war is mostly over in Eregion, and Sauron had recovered all the rings it coveted (save the Three and the one 'lesser' ring given to Durin). It sound reasonnable that by 1700 - 1800 Sauron has given nine rings to great men to create the Nazgul. It take century (from, say 1800 to 2200) to transform Men to Nazgûl.
Yes, regardless of the actual dates involved it seems to have taken many centuries, perhaps several thousand years, for the transformation from Man to Ringwraith to become complete. The Dwarves seem to have been immune to that particular risk; I am not even certain that one of the Great Rings would have made a Dwarf invisible--though I wonder if a Dwarf killed by the poison of a Morgul-blade would have become a Wraith? If we want to explore this last question in more detail, we might want to start another thread.

It may be worth noting that the Seven Rings of the Dwarves do not seem to differ in any significant way from the Nine. They were not made specifically for the Dwarves though the Naugrim were affected by them in a different manner than were Mortal Men. From Tolkien's essay "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age":
But Sauron gathered into his hands all the remaining Rings of Power; and he dealt them out to the other peoples of Middle-earth, hoping thus to bring under his sway all those that desired secret power beyond the measure of their kind. Seven rings he gave to the Dwarves; but to Men he gave nine, for Men proved in this matter as in others the readiest to his will. And all those rings that he governed he perverted the more easily since he had a part in their making, and they were accursed, and they betrayed in the end all those that used them. The Dwarves indeed proved tough and hard to tame; they ill endure the domination of others, and the thoughts of their hearts are hard to fathom, nor can they be turned to shadows. They used their rings only for the getting of wealth; but wrath and an overmastering greed of gold were kindled in their hearts, of which evil enough came after to the profit of Sauron. It is said that the foundation of each of the Seven Hoards of the Dwarf-kings of old was a golden ring; but all those hoards long ago were plundered and the Dragons devoured them, and of the Seven Rings some were consumed in fire and some Sauron recovered.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

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