Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

The place for discussion of Cubicle 7 and Sophisticated Games' "Adventures in Middle-earth" OGL setting.
Sama64
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Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:58 pm

Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Sama64 » Mon May 08, 2017 1:09 pm

Hi to everyone, this is my 1st post i presume :oops:

I'll use this topic for a question about playing in AiME before the fall of Arnor/Arthedain (for example about 1640 Third Age).
Do you think there will be a lot of changes in terms of game mechanics ? I mean races, classes, etc...

My goal is to use old MERP adventures with AiME rules.

Thanks in advance

note : sorry for my typos and errors, i am not english native spreaker

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Otaku-sempai » Mon May 08, 2017 3:11 pm

Year 1640 (Third Age)
  • No Beornings.
  • No Bardings.
  • Durin's Folk still dwell in Khazad-dûm; the Lonely Mountain is unoccupied.
  • Lake-town might exist, but might be located on the shore of Long Lake at this time.
  • The Shire was founded only thirty-nine years ago.
  • Arthedain still stands, so no Rangers of the North as such.
  • No Rohirrim; their ancestors the Éothéod dwell either in the Vales of the Anduin or possibly on the plains of eastern Rhovanion.
  • The Kin-strife of two hundred years ago greatly weakened Gondor. The Great Plague struck only four years ago, further sapping the nation's strength. In this year the royal court is moved to Minas Anor.
  • Dwarves still dwell in the Blue Mountains, but mostly south of the Gulf of Lune; most of the Dwarves of Belegost and Nogrod relocated to Khazad-dûm early in the Second Age.
  • High Elves still live and wander in the lands between the Blue Mountains and the River Lune.
Cultures:
  • The Bardings do not exist.
  • The Beornings do not exist. However, you might be able to adapt the culture to reflect the ancestors of Beorn--especially for a movie-based campaign. Perhaps other clans of skin-changers had different totem-animals.
  • The Dúnedain needs to be reworked to reflect the still existent North Kingdom.
  • Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain need to be rewritten as Dwarves of Khazad-dûm.
  • Elves of Mirkwood are largely the same.
  • Hobbits of the Shire are largely the same. Keep in mind that the Stoors are only lately arrived (TA 1630).
  • Men of Bree might not change much, though Bree-land would see many more travelers at this time. Fornost Erain to the north is still occupied at this time and is the capital of Arthedain.
  • Men of the Lake might need to be tweaked a bit. The current Esgaroth might be more of a fishing village than a trading center.
  • Men of Minas Tirith becomes Men of Minas Anor (same place, earlier name) and may need some tweaks.
  • Riders of Rohan become the Éothéod and are not yet strongly affiliated with Gondor.
  • Woodmen of Wilderland might remain much the same.
Last edited by Otaku-sempai on Mon May 08, 2017 4:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

Sama64
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Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:58 pm

Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Sama64 » Mon May 08, 2017 3:37 pm

Thanks a lot, that's a detailed answer :)

so it is quite easy, by just dropping some cultures and tweaking some others.

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Otaku-sempai » Mon May 08, 2017 4:19 pm

Sama64 wrote:
Mon May 08, 2017 3:37 pm
Thanks a lot, that's a detailed answer :)
You're welcome. Though the first section repeats a lot of what is in the timeline.
so it is quite easy, by just dropping some cultures and tweaking some others.
Maybe? You are going to need to consider how those changes affect Cultural Virtues, Backgrounds, and Cultural Heirlooms.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

Sama64
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Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:58 pm

Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Sama64 » Mon May 08, 2017 4:30 pm

well...i haven't gone that far in the Player's guide for the moment. :oops:
So i have'nt considered "how those changes affect Cultural Virtues, Backgrounds, and Cultural Heirlooms" yet.

I suppose I will have to ask for advice on the forum ;)

Enevhar Aldarion
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Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Enevhar Aldarion » Mon May 08, 2017 10:58 pm

Each of the MERP adventures includes a small section on adapting the adventure for use during the years of the novels. So if you read those and see what they say to add or change, that could give you an idea of what to remove from AiME instead.

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Southron
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Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Southron » Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:12 am

OS where did you gather your information of PJ's timeline. Especially the imprisoned Nazgul?

Though I love T-canon, I do like the truncated timeline as it provides a great sense of urgency.

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Otaku-sempai » Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:13 am

Southron wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:12 am
OS where did you gather your information of PJ's timeline. Especially the imprisoned Nazgul?

Though I love T-canon, I do like the truncated timeline as it provides a great sense of urgency.
I derived what I could from the films (extended editions) and background materials (Weta books, appendices, etc.). However, much of my Jackson-specific timeline is deduction, extrapolation or merely educated guesses. Jackson's changes really mess with Tolkien's history of Middle-earth during the Third Age, especially if the Nine are missing so soon after the fall of Arthedain in TA 1974. They need to be around at least long enough for the Witch-king to dispose of Eärnur, the last king of Gondor.

My goal was to stay with Tolkien's legendarium as much as possible to honor the original canon and so that the changes might make some sort of sense and wouldn't seem too disruptive.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

badkabuki
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Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by badkabuki » Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:20 pm

This is great Otaku-sempai.
I ran a Third Age MERP game years ago that I am adapting to AiME. I started my campaign in TA 1408 so I could have the back drop of the Fall of Amon Sul and the Kin-strife as central narrative threads. I rather prefer this time as there is more leeway to play with convention while still maintaining a canonical feel.
My changes reflect yours almost exactly with the following amendments.
  • Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain are changed to Dwarves of Middle-Earth: The Erebor origin applying to Dwarves of Khazad Dum and the Iron Hills origin applying to Dwarves of the Grey Mountains, although I would change their Standard of Living to Martial. I don't think there were Dwarves in the Blue Mountains in TA 1408.
  • Dunedain are the same with the exception of having Raised in the Wild replaced with something I call Heritage of Westernesse which gives proficiency with Insight rolls.
  • Elves of Mirkwood are renamed Elves of Middle-earth and are virtually the same except that I allow Elves who call Lorien home to know some Quenya. With Rivendell besieged around this time and Mirkwood showing signs of the Shadow I decided to just keep the Standard of Living as Martial for all Elves. Since I don't allow for Noldor PC's I didn't need to make accommodations for them.
  • Hobbits of the Shire are renamed Hobbits of Middle-Earth. Mostly the same, except that I changed the Standard of Living of all three lines to Frugal or Martial. In this period they have no fixed home really and must spend the bulk of their time just hiding from all the other people of Middle-Earth. This is only relevant for play before the founding of the Shire.
  • Men of the Lake are now Men of Tharbad: virtually no other changes needed mechanically
  • Men of Minas Tirith is likewise renamed to Men of Minas Anor but also reflect the Men of Fornost, except with a Standard of Living as Martial. Mechanically, they are fine as is.
Most Cultural Virtues don't present too much of an issue except the Dunedain Royalty Revealed and the Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain Raven of the Mountain, both of which reflect virtues from events that have yet to occurred in TA 1408. As of this writing I just encourage players to bypass them until I have a chance to rework them.

My two cents. Happy gaming.
Otaku-sempai wrote:
Mon May 08, 2017 3:11 pm
Year 1640 (Third Age)
  • No Beornings.
  • No Bardings.
  • Durin's Folk still dwell in Khazad-dûm; the Lonely Mountain is unoccupied.
  • Lake-town might exist, but might be located on the shore of Long Lake at this time.
  • The Shire was founded only thirty-nine years ago.
  • Arthedain still stands, so no Rangers of the North as such.
  • No Rohirrim; their ancestors the Éothéod dwell either in the Vales of the Anduin or possibly on the plains of eastern Rhovanion.
  • The Kin-strife of two hundred years ago greatly weakened Gondor. The Great Plague struck only four years ago, further sapping the nation's strength. In this year the royal court is moved to Minas Anor.
  • Dwarves still dwell in the Blue Mountains, but mostly south of the Gulf of Lune; most of the Dwarves of Belegost and Nogrod relocated to Khazad-dûm early in the Second Age.
  • High Elves still live and wander in the lands between the Blue Mountains and the River Lune.
Cultures:
  • The Bardings do not exist.
  • The Beornings do not exist. However, you might be able to adapt the culture to reflect the ancestors of Beorn--especially for a movie-based campaign. Perhaps other clans of skin-changers had different totem-animals.
  • The Dúnedain needs to be reworked to reflect the still existent North Kingdom.
  • Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain need to be rewritten as Dwarves of Khazad-dûm.
  • Elves of Mirkwood are largely the same.
  • Hobbits of the Shire are largely the same. Keep in mind that the Stoors are only lately arrived (TA 1630).
  • Men of Bree might not change much, though Bree-land would see many more travelers at this time. Fornost Erain to the north is still occupied at this time and is the capital of Arthedain.
  • Men of the Lake might need to be tweaked a bit. The current Esgaroth might be more of a fishing village than a trading center.
  • Men of Minas Tirith becomes Men of Minas Anor (same place, earlier name) and may need some tweaks.
  • Riders of Rohan become the Éothéod and are not yet strongly affiliated with Gondor.
  • Woodmen of Wilderland might remain much the same.

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Alternate timeline for a film-based campaign

Post by Otaku-sempai » Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:47 pm

badkabuki wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:20 pm
  • Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain are changed to Dwarves of Middle-Earth: The Erebor origin applying to Dwarves of Khazad Dum and the Iron Hills origin applying to Dwarves of the Grey Mountains, although I would change their Standard of Living to Martial. I don't think there were Dwarves in the Blue Mountains in TA 1408.
I hope your players enjoyed your campaign! The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm should maintain a Rich Standard of Living right up until they disturb the Balrog, having benefited both from the influx of Dwarves of the Blue Mountains early in the Second Age and their later alliance with the Elves of Eregion.

My guess is that you are thinking chiefly of the survivors of Nogrod and Belegost who relocated to Khazad-dûm in the early decades of the Second Age. Yes, there were Dwarves still inhabiting the Blue Mountains throughout the Second and Third Ages and into the Fourth. This is noted in Appendix A in The Lord of the Rings at the beginning of the discussion of "Eriador, Arnor, and the Heirs of Isildur":
Beyond the Lune was Elvish country, green and quiet, where no Man went; but Dwarves dwelt, and still dwell, in the east side of the Blue Mountains, especially in those parts south of the Gulf of Lune, where they have mines that are still in use.
The Adventurer's Companion for TOR gives the Dwarves of the Blue Mountains a Standard of Living of Prosperous. Between relations with the Dwarves of Khazad-dûm and commerce with the Men of Arthedain, I see no reason to downgrade that for a TA 1408 campaign. They might even supply metals and metalwork to the Elves of the Grey Havens.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

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