Can a Dwarf Player-hero make Dwarf-forged weapons and armours?

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Michebugio
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Can a Dwarf Player-hero make Dwarf-forged weapons and armours?

Post by Michebugio » Fri May 19, 2017 12:25 pm

Pretty much what the title says.

Consider that one of my players is a Dwarf of the Lonely Mountain, and he has both proficiency with smith's tools and the Smith-craft Speciality from his background.

Would you allow him to create Dwarf-forged weapons and armours (with a +1 enhancement), assuming that he has access to the foundries of Erebor? If yes, what would be required to do that (a Fellowship phase undertaking, an investment, enough standing to be admitted into Erebor's foundries, etc.)?

I think that if a Loremaster is going to allow this, it should come with some limitation, otherwise a Dwarf player could very easily provide Dwarf-forged equipment for the entire Company at little or no cost .

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Can a Dwarf Player-hero make Dwarf-forged weapons and armours?

Post by Otaku-sempai » Fri May 19, 2017 2:00 pm

So, you are asking if a player Dwarf-hero with the appropriate skills should be allowed to craft Dwarf-forged Weapons and Armor as described on page 192 of the Player's Guide?

I don't see why not, but I would suggest that at least half of the listed cost should be spent for time, effort and materials. He must have Tool Proficiency (smith's tools), Smith-craft, the proper tools and forge (which might also be available in Dale or Lake-town, not just Erebor).

A prerequisite might be that the character has spent a Fellowship phase on the Undertaking of Study with a Master Craftsman (from the Erebor sourcebook for TOR; ordinarily simply allowing the Dwarf-hero in TOR to gain his next Craft level at half the cost in Advancement points), ending with a successful Ability check at a DC 20 to craft an item (I'm leaning towards an Intelligence check, but given Dwarven attitudes toward smithing it might arguably be a Wisdom check). Rules for Crafting are in Chapter 8 of the Player's Basic Rules for D&D 5e (available as a free PDF from WotC).

These are just my thoughts off the top of my head. Someone else might well have better insights.
Last edited by Otaku-sempai on Fri May 19, 2017 11:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

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ThrorII
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Re: Can a Dwarf Player-hero make Dwarf-forged weapons and armours?

Post by ThrorII » Fri May 19, 2017 9:10 pm

I'd say YES.

The One Ring Erebor sourcebook has two undertakings related to that, called something like 'Study with a Dwarf Craftsman' and 'Dwarf-smithing'. I'd use these for inspiration on how to do it.

I'd first require a Dwarf wanting to create a Dwarf-forged item to first be proficient with smith-tools and have the Smithcraft speciality.

Then, the Dwarf would have to spend an undertaking in Erebor, Lake-town, Iron Hills or Blue Mountains to 'Study with a Dwarf Craftsman'.

Finally, after that, the player Dwarf may spend undertakings anywhere Dwarf-forges are found to craft one Dwarf-forged item. The item could be sold for 1/2 value (based on the Player's Guide pricing, with the other half going to construction and lifestyle upkeep) or it could be kept or gifted away.

Those are my thoughts anyway. I've mined TOR to create those two undertakings for my future campaign. I wouldn't require any skill rolls, personally. The character is spending 2 undertakings to be able to do this. That is a large investment from the player.

BookBarbarian
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Re: Can a Dwarf Player-hero make Dwarf-forged weapons and armours?

Post by BookBarbarian » Fri May 19, 2017 10:06 pm

It seems perfectly suited to an undertaking to me.

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Can a Dwarf Player-hero make Dwarf-forged weapons and armours?

Post by Otaku-sempai » Fri May 19, 2017 10:51 pm

The Fellowship Undertaking: Dwarven-smithing is a time-consuming process used to create a single masterwork weapon or piece of defensive gear blessed with one Enchanted Quality. There is a pretty big restriction:
  • A Dwarven smith can only enchant one item in his lifetime -- the work of long years and the draining act of exerting all their prowess cannot be readily repeated.
This seems like too much for what the PC wants to accomplish, going beyond what is meant by Dwarf-forged. It's not just crafting, say, a Dwarf-forged Great Axe (+1); it's about creating something like a Great Axe of Dragon Slaying or Ring-mail of Fire Resistance.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

andypalmer
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Re: Can a Dwarf Player-hero make Dwarf-forged weapons and armours?

Post by andypalmer » Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:01 am

I had the same question and researched The One Ring books. In those, some of the item Qualities listed in the Loremaster Guide are not Enchanted (in The One Ring) and could be crafted still in the 3rd Age. I therefore came up with the following:

Crafting in general: 5e has a rule of 5gp of value each full day or work. Doing a comparison, I think treating one 5e gold piece as one AIME silver penny is a good conversion. A suit of heavy mail (75s) would take 15 days to craft. A suit of Dwarf-Forged Heavy Mail (250s) would take 50 days to craft. These numbers don’t seem unreasonable.

OPEN CULTURAL VIRTUE
MASTER SMITH
Requires proficiency in Smith Tools, Level 4.
You have completed an apprenticeship to a smith of renown and may now craft quality weapons, shields, and armor.

You can learn how to smith one Quality when you first select this virtue, and may learn a new one as your undertaking during later Fellowship phases. May add no more than one quality to an item until level 8 and no more than two until level 12.

Adding the first Quality to a weapon or shield costs 2 gold pieces + 3x the listed base cost of the item. Adding a second Quality costs an additional 5 gold pieces + 4x the listed base cost of the item. Adding a third Quality costs an additional 10 gold pieces + 5x the listed base cost of the item.

Adding the first Quality to a suit of armor costs 5 gold pieces + 2x the listed base cost of the armor. Adding a second Quality costs an additional 8 gold pieces + 3x the listed base cost of the armor. Adding a third Quality costs an additional 11 gold pieces + 4x the listed base cost of the armor.

Close-fitting
Item: Armor
This quality adds +2 AC bonus to this armor’s standard Armor Class.

Cunning Make
Item: Armor or Shield
This Quality enhances the AC rating of this armor or shield by +1. Halve this armor’s weight. Strength Requirements are lowered by 3, and its user no longer suffers Disadvantage on Stealth checks.

Dwarf-Forged

Only Dwarves
Item: Armor or Weapon
A Dwarf-forged Weapon adds a +1 bonus to all attack and damage rolls made with it. A suit of Dwarf-forged Armor causes all critical hits against its wearer to become normal hits.

Fell
Item: Weapon
Add +2 to all attack rolls with this weapon.

Grievous
Item: Weapon
This Quality adds a +2 bonus to all damage rolls made with this weapon. The bonus damage from Grievous doubles on a critical hit.

Keen
Item: Weapon
You may enchant a Dwarf-Forged weapon with the Keen enchantment. Treat as having a cost of 2x the price of the Dwarf-Forged item.

Reinforced
Item: Shield
+1 AC bonus to the standard Armor Class this shield normally provides. Additionally, this shield cannot be smashed by normal means.

DWARVEN SMITHING
Once in their lifetime, a Dwarf with the Master Smith virtue may craft an item with an Enchantment Quality. This item may or may not have up to two normal Qualities as well (rules for handling that are handled above). To do so, the Dwarf must, at a minimum, spend d6+6 Fellowship phases doing the Dwarf-Smithing undertaking. The Loremaster may also require quests for materials or lore to aid in the creation of the enchantment. The cost of the enchantment will be determined by the Loremaster, but will generally be at least double the cost of placing a third quality on an item.

See LoreMaster Guide for list of Enchanted Qualities. Those Qualities not listed above are considered Enchanted for this purpose.

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