Elves of Lorien starting weapon skill sets

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Falenthal
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Re: Elves of Lorien starting weapon skill sets

Post by Falenthal » Mon Feb 27, 2017 9:22 pm

I misremembered the table, then. I'm sure you're right about it only applying to Common Skills.

Regarding the usefulness of Favourite skills... yes, I also find it a bit disappointing.

I remember thinking that the Mastery dice mechanic could be tried with Favourite skills (if it weren't used for Masteries, of course). Don't know how it would turn out.

Or, linked with the thread about Weary effects:
When using a Favourite skill, the Weary status only counts the 1s and 2s as 0s.

voronwe
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Re: Elves of Lorien starting weapon skill sets

Post by voronwe » Mon Feb 27, 2017 9:25 pm

Rich H wrote: In what way are they better? A Barding only gets competency with Great Bow, Elves of Lorien get all bows so have a massive amount of versatility - especially where using a bow in forest comes into play; as LM I would apply a -2 or -4 penalty to using a great bow under certain conditions, quite easily. Rather than messing around with starting weapon skill sets, I could find a more convincing argument to making Bow of the Galadhrim a bow rather than a great bow.
Yes, my final idea is that the best and less intrusive propposal to do is making Bow of the Galadhrim a Bow rather than a Great Bow (but applying the range and power -damage and edge- of a Great Bow).

I humbly don't share your view about the upper hand of versatility, though; not in a game where superior weapons are not supposed to be found randomly during adventures (ey, see, a +1 Bow, better than my starting Great Bow!) like in other games but through a scheduled reward and point-costing system in which it is the player and the Loremaster who decide(s) the exact superior weapon to receive or enhace.

Moreover, all my thoughts on this matter were, and are, based on what it is said in the books; in that regard, I have to say again that what is stated in "Farewell to Lorien" makes me think that the Galadhrim used as a rule the very same kind of bow that Galadriel gave to Legolas (this one could be particularly better, but it doesn't dismantle the fact that the Galadhrim bows were longer and stouter than the Woodland Realm's ones).

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Rich H
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Re: Elves of Lorien starting weapon skill sets

Post by Rich H » Mon Feb 27, 2017 9:56 pm

voronwe wrote:Yes, my final idea is that the best and less intrusive propposal to do is making Bow of the Galadhrim a Bow rather than a Great Bow (but applying the range and power -damage and edge- of a Great Bow).
I personally wouldn't go that far. You're quite quickly making that Reward significantly better than others in the game.
voronwe wrote:I humbly don't share your view about the upper hand of versatility, though; not in a game where superior weapons are not supposed to be found randomly during adventures (ey, see, a +1 Bow, better than my starting Great Bow!) like in other games but through a scheduled reward and point-costing system in which it is the player and the Loremaster who decide(s) the exact superior weapon to receive or enhace.
A great bow can't use the called shot Rain of Arrows, either; great bows aren't automatically better than bows - the task at hand can often be a determining factor. And the treasure rules do bring in a bit of a random element to finding weapons and armour of great power, although the LM still may build the list. A culture with (bows) rather than just a bow of a specific type offers more options and versatility allowing a culture to fight as skirmishers within enclosed/close quarters as well as in the field in larger scale battles; I think this kind of thing is often (badly) ignored by GMs. And a Lorien Elf can still use the reward when all is said and done - favoured weapon skills are overrated, as previously mentioned.
voronwe wrote:Moreover, all my thoughts on this matter were, and are, based on what it is said in the books; in that regard, I have to say again that what is stated in "Farewell to Lorien" makes me think that the Galadhrim used as a rule the very same kind of bow that Galadriel gave to Legolas (this one could be particularly better, but it doesn't dismantle the fact that the Galadhrim bows were longer and stouter than the Woodland Realm's ones).
Ah Legolas, using a bow and then a great bow... Yeah, versatility in bows isn't all its cracked up to be, is it. Alternately, a bow that is a different size to others doesn't automatically mean it becomes a great bow; not all bows are the same size yet still fall into the bow weapon type rather than being great bows.

Personally, yeah, I'd make the reward a bow rather than great bow if I was altering it at all.

voronwe
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Re: Elves of Lorien starting weapon skill sets

Post by voronwe » Tue Feb 28, 2017 9:44 pm

Oops! This morning I recalled this quote from Professor Tolkien himself:

"He was as tall as a young tree, lithe, immensely strong, able swiftly to draw a great war-bow and shoot down a Nazgûl, endowed with the tremendous vitality of Elvish bodies, so hard and resistant to hurt that he went only in light shoes over rock or through snow, the most tireless of all the Fellowship."
—J.R.R. Tolkien on Legolas [The History of Middle-earth, Vol. 2: The Book of Lost Tales Part Two, VI: "The History of Eriol or Ælfwine and the End of the Tales" ]


So Professor Tolkien himself called the Galadhrim bow a "great war-bow".

Furthermore, another quote/reference about the same: [tLotR, Chapter IX "The Great River"] "Suddenly the great bow of Lórien sang".

This point settled, then. It is a great bow. Not considering it a Great Bow in game terms would seem a bit out of place after this... Then I'll have to start whining :lol: again about the weapon sets configuration... I agree on the minor relevance of favoured skills in the long run, and I can't deny that being able to use both Bow and Great Bow presents practical advantages... maybe it is simply that I can't see the Galadhrim using different kinds of bows in war after all those quotes posted (here and in previous posts)...

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Re: Elves of Lorien starting weapon skill sets

Post by Otaku-sempai » Tue Feb 28, 2017 11:55 pm

That's good enough for me!
DR. MANHATTAN: I'm leaving this galaxy for one less complicated.
OZYMANDIAS: But you'd regained interest in human life...
DR. MANHATTAN: Yes, I have. I think perhaps I'll create some. Goodbye, Adrian.

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